DAVID SUSSKIND INTRODUCES JEWISH MEN IN SHOW BUSINESS: MEL BROOKS, LARRY GOLDBERG, DAN GREENBURG (WRITER), GEORGE SEGAL (ACTOR), STAN HERMAN (DESIGNER), DAVID STEINBERG (WRITER). HF-YTV

1970 DAVID SUSSKIND SHOW - HOW TO BE A JEWISH SON - WITH MEL BROOKS, DAVID STEINBERG, GEORGE SEGAL , STAN HERMAN , DAN GREENBURG , LARRY GOLDBERG - JEWISH MEN IN SHOW BUSINESS JEWISH COMEDY

"HOW TO BE A JEWISH SON, OR MY SON THE SUCCESS!" WITH MEL BROOKS, DAVID STEINBERG, GEORGE SEGAL, STAN HERMAN, DAN GREENBURG, LARRY GOLDBERG. JEWISH MEN IN SHOW BUSINESS (HF-YTV)

"HOW TO BE A JEWISH SON, OR MY SON THE SUCCESS!" WITH MEL BROOKS, DAVID STEINBERG, GEORGE SEGAL, STAN HERMAN, DAN GREENBURG, LARRY GOLDBERG. JEWISH MEN IN SHOW BUSINESS

INTERVIEW RESUMES: David Susskind 10:02 The thing you just did reminds me must have been born out of your years as a social director in the Catskills. Mel Brooks 10:07 Yes I was a pool tumbler David Susskind 10:09 What is that? Mel Brooks 10:09 Well, I an entertainer, I wasn't a real comic yet, I was allowed to entertain the guests at the pool. After lunch, I would come out with a derby and a heavy alpaca coat in the middle of July. Two heavy suitcases filled with bricks. And I would jump off the diving board screaming I don't want to live and that would give them a laugh after lunch to settle down with us to serve food in the mountains. They served me a thing when I don't know what it was. It was like something wrapped in something you know what the heavy dough and it was like undercooked with a little noodle with a little meat. I don't know what it was. I called it Harold. And it laid onto my heart for three years. And every day I'd say good morning Harold. How are you? Remember when I ate you your little devil? Worst food in the world? David Susskind 11:04 What was that? You know, everyone today says that that was the great breeding place. Mel Brooks 11:08 It was a sporty place for a lot of Jewish comedians, David Susskind 11:12 because we're those tough people to please. I mean Mel Brooks 11:15 Tough? they liked nothing. I used to do an hour and a half in one. With taps with everything I'd sing I dance, I tell stories and jokes. I do Jolie. I kill myself. And I say I don't like me, folks. You stink your state. And they were the critics. Atkinson and Crowder in their equivalents that Jewish Jewish lady would be in the tea room in the tea room, a little sponge cake and tea and you go by and they say never mind we like you'll never mind. That comment. I don't mind doing Don't worry. You. Never mind. You don't have to be good for us. David Susskind 11:49 that'll break your heart Mel Brooks 11:53 They like nothing. They only said all I ever heard was $16 a day. Let's breathe. David Susskind 12:01 Oh, you were in high school in college. You had a jazz band it Bruno Lynch and his Imperial Jazz Band. BRUNO Lynch. George Segal 12:09 Bruno Lynch Yes. i In all honesty, I did change my name at one time in my career. David Susskind 12:14 So you did George Segal 12:15 Yes, I did. Because I felt that George Segal in his Imperial jazz band didn't have the rhythm didn't have the spunk didn't have to go. BRUNO Lynch and his Imperial jazz. What do you think? David Susskind 12:25 Which is why Bruno Lynch became a household word and a great record seller. Yes. Mel Brooks 12:29 Did you kidnap that Lindbergh baby? David Susskind 12:32 Where you, were you uh? Oh Lord. Were you a success a lot of places George Segal 12:48 Yes I had some success. Yes, I saying I wish I could show me that. I was the vocalist also for the band and I was the organizer and leader of the band which was the only way that I could play with the band. Since I was the worst musician in the band. They were very good musicians David Steinberg 13:01 George, would you do something for us now? George Segal 13:05 I wish I could Jimmy like my sister Kate. Oh, she takes it like cupola jelly on a plate and all the boys in the neighborhood. They know she does it and it's mighty going oh I know I'm late but I'll be up to date if I can take it David Susskind 13:15 you're all right it's it's it's it's a ghastly way to go the trouble is you never know when he's acting. George Segal 13:42 What are you doing? David Susskind 13:44 I'm just I'm putting your mic and putting your mic back up. Mel Brooks 13:49 George, you're on the David Susskind show. you'll be home in a half hour David Susskind 13:57 when did you and how did you get the show business? You alright, George George Segal 14:02 I'm okay I'm okay. David Susskind 14:05 You won't have to sing again. David Mel Brooks 14:08 I think God heard you sing and said.. David Susskind 14:16 David, how and when did you get the show business bug? David Steinberg 14:19 Oh it's not an interesting story. David Susskind 14:23 Weren't you were being prepared for being a Rabbi David Steinberg 14:26 yes they used to salt me two hours every day prepared? No i i studied that. I took a degree of Hebrew literature but that's not rabbinical. That's Mel Brooks 14:41 you learn the mother tongue did your mother tongue is yet when you want to hear the real mother tongue Yes. When you come up already at six o'clock What am I gonna just keep it hot all the time for you. You're not gonna eat. That's all your everybody's eating but you that is the mother tongue David Susskind 15:01 I remember you had a brief fling on Broadway Stan Herman 15:04 Yeah, I did. David Susskind 15:05 tried to be in Stan Herman 15:06 I got out of the dress business I decided to be a singer I was in on. I was Pierre Olaf's under study that was my big claim to fame. I saw myself as Rock Hudson and they saw me as Pierre Olaf so I got out of show business. I also did George I sang I did you know those 12 hits for $1 that used to buy in the in the five and 10 where you think it was Elvis Presley and you think I was the Everly Brothers both of them? I was telling Della Reese because they're Mel Brooks 15:33 Notice the way he's looking for the next question. Yeah Stan Herman 15:39 that was my that was my Mel Brooks 15:40 intention. How cruel. How sharp this business, how evil really? I mean the band's the middle of a very terribly boring story for the next question, burying you're ready to turn out terrible I think God has taken a dislike to you and you know his punishments are terrific. David Susskind 16:06 Could you project what will happen? Mel Brooks 16:10 A flood. he's very good at what you do as you can see here, alright, without standing without you guys. Without standing and they give us four bars. I don't see anything you know, Joe. You know Joe Greene's work, don't you? Yes. That's Joe. Great. Do a little Giuseppe version. Be Wayne, that's easy. Stan Herman 16:42 Okay Daddy domani not that serious. Mel Brooks 16:47 That was very good, by the way Stan Herman 16:54 Not bad, if you want to come down to the Bowery and watch me sing at the Bowery Mel Brooks 16:57 I've got a maroon Buick parked outside. If you want to go down the Bowery David Susskind 17:04 as you talk about your Mothers Day Mel Brooks 17:06 As you talk, I didn't say a word Dan Greenburg 17:08 The question begins as you talk about your mothers. Read the question please David Susskind 17:21 Were your mothers really the original. Original women's liberation is you know, I mean, it's not Kate MILLETTE. And, Bella, Dan Greenburg 17:30 no, I don't think they know what to make of that. I don't really think they know what to make of that. No, but their mother's mother's mother's David Susskind 17:37 Father was the provider Mel Brooks 17:42 what's the status quo? Right? That's traditionalists. And if this is a movement, they're against any movement, per se, I think Jewish mothers. Dan Greenburg 17:51 Yeah. But also it's really the whole opposite of what a Jewish mother is all about. I mean, women's liberation is so one to equal rights and so on. Mothers don't want equal rights. The duty Mel Brooks 18:02 they want domination David Susskind 18:05 When you see once a week, you see your folks. Oh they live in Chicago. When you do see your folks, do you discuss Dan Greenburg 18:11 We eat a lot George Segal 18:12 I met Dan's dance folks on the beach. You possibly didn't know that? Mel Brooks 18:16 I didn't. Even as you speak I don't know. George Segal 18:20 So tell us I met I met the MR. MRS. Greenberg. And they're lovely. Quiet cuties. Mel Brooks 18:26 What was your mother upset with the book? I mean, did she think that anything was you know? Dan Greenburg 18:30 No, because I told her it wasn't about her. It isn't. My mother is a nice English lady. A wonderful accent very charming. My mother Mel Brooks 18:42 did not watch what she did. She you know, asked you about Dan Greenburg 18:45 she said what is this place? And no, I totally was a very gentle, loving book and everything. And some people whispered in the ear that it wasn't quite that but no she she really loved when she got to be a kind of a local celebrity in her Hebrew school. She teaches Hebrew school and people stop in the Hebrew school and ask for her autograph. It's very cute. Mel Brooks 19:06 Did they did she sign it from right to left? That's pretty lovely. She does. She teaches you teaches you I will be in Chicago. I'm promoting. We're opening Dan Greenburg 19:16 look her up Mel Brooks 19:16 We're opening 12 chirs in Chicago. Dan Greenburg 19:20 You want a nice brisket. call my mother a nice brisket with noodle kugel. Mel Brooks 19:25 I would love it. Will it lay on to my heart like Harold? I will seriously Yeah, I will say hello to you folks. When I get happy people. Happy people. David Susskind 19:34 That's lovely aside you've had David Steinberg 19:37 Will you say hello to my folks when we get to Chicago too Mel Brooks 19:39 I didn't know you're from Chicago. David Steinberg 19:40 I know my folks are in LA Mel Brooks 19:41 but can you call them long distance while I'm in Chicago? David Steinberg 19:45 No, there I moved my family to Los Angeles with a thought that I would never be there. physically from Canada and now I find myself in Los Angeles every second weekend. We're just in the same hassle field. Mel Brooks 19:57 Where do they live in LA? What area David Steinberg 19:59 My mother lives across. It's really interesting. There's a big reformed temple in in Los Angeles, Mel Brooks 20:06 like to stay close to God. David Steinberg 20:08 Close to the temple. Yeah. But, but what's interesting about it is that in Los Angeles, I think there is this rabbi who went to school for 12 years to get his degree of Rubik's. He has a degree of Hebrew literature. He went to Hebrew University for four years to get an MA in English Literature comes to Los Angeles as the leading congregation. And as people pass by the seat that's Buddy Hackett shul David Susskind 20:40 that's funny hold it a minute back in a minute

BACK IN STUDIO - INTERVIEW CONTINUES: David Susskind 10:45 David Steinberg, David Steinberg 10:52 David Susskind David Susskind 10:55 Do You have any particular burden having been born in a very religious household? Your father was a rabbi. David Steinberg 11:01 Yes. I've been there two things that I never really think about. And that is my mother and transvestites. David Susskind 11:12 Could you tell me why? Why you chose not to think of these things? David Steinberg 11:16 I don't know, David. I just never thought of it before. My mother. I don't think about my mother that much. You know, David Susskind 11:23 does she is she living? David Steinberg 11:27 Yes. I mean, we haven't spoken in the last five minutes. But she's alive. I have dreams. You know, I have dreams, as we all do. David Susskind 11:35 What are some of your dreams David Steinberg 11:38 I'm in the middle of this gigantic ocean. And I'm on a huge luxury liner. There's no one on board the entire ship except me and my mother. And we're in this grand ballroom. And we drink seltzer from Jared bone. And we dance to burn. I'm three and she's 52. And I'm just about to get her in my crib. And I wake up. And I'm like everyone else. Yeah. Every night every Tuesday, usually David Susskind 12:18 every Tuesday. As a lay analyst. How would you feel about that? Mel Brooks 12:26 You can see that the the filter, the disgusting dirtiness. We won't talk about that aspect. But the other things are very interesting. For instance, he says, we were all alone on a luxury line. Well, that can be interpreted very simply in Freudian terms as to people being alone on a luxury liner. That's why David Susskind 12:52 I never would have thought of it that way. Mel Brooks 12:54 That's the meaning behind that. And the other thing is ocean. The ocean is absolutely fetal stage, Fetal, meaning that your feet in the ocean, so therefor there is a salt water connotation to that. That probably gargling with salt water makes sense memory of being inside mama at a very early age. So analyzing it, I would say it's not hard to figure out because the dream is paper. Right? But it's difficult to go less so to speak. David Susskind 13:32 I'm glad I asked you that yes clears up the whole dream. Dan, you in your book, you deal with such things as how to administer the third helping how to make guilt work. You explain how a mother makes guilt work? Dan Greenburg 13:47 Well, for instance, I can tell you the effect it's had on me for instance, I'm now 34 years old, which is a fair a fairly old age for a person who must finish every single thing on his plate. Everything on everybody else's plate at the table. And even in restaurants going gets embarrassing going out other people's tables and saying listen, could you does you're not going to eat that I would be very glad to take it home. It's very embarrassing. Mel Brooks 14:14 Does your mother say that carrot on your plate is so lonely for the carrot in your stomach. Dan Greenburg 14:20 Yes, yes. That's the other curious thing that has happened which I attribute to my mother is that I feel anthropomorphic about about things like wastepaper, filth and like talking on the show. wastepaper I cannot throw out because I feel it is a rejection of the waste paper and so I save sheets of waste paper cardboard, I save string, old manila envelopes which I use again, I've never sent out or bought a new manila envelopes. You get a thing from I've received scripts from things crossed off on it. It's terrific. Apple sauce sauce jars. Empty Bufferin bottles. Mel Brooks 15:00 I didn't see a glass till I was 38 David Susskind 15:03 what were you drinking out of? Mel Brooks 15:04 fruit fruit jelly jars jelly, right? The wait an hour for it to get cold, right? Wait another hour for the cloud to make itself into water right? Because it's very white when it comes out of the tap. And then you smash into another jelly jar. You say confusion to the French I don't know what you said. We're just a confusion to the French. Very classic. David Susskind 15:28 He interrupted you George George Segal 15:29 No, I was just I haven't I find now as you talk about your composure that I doors in men's rooms on a problem to me I will tend if it's if it's like a hook handle, I will tend to get my pinky under the least part of the hand of what I feel the least number of people have opened the door by that because who knows maybe they haven't washed their hands. God knows I haven't. David Susskind 15:51 This this is a heritage from your mother George Segal 15:54 beats me where I got that from but he was talking about Dan Greenburg 15:56 You're a source of contamination of public restrooms David Steinberg 16:02 to California, because in California when you go to a men's room, you get called the Cavaleiro. I like to know when I'm coming out of a men's room for just what I did. I'm all of a sudden that Cavaleiro Dan Greenburg 16:13 only certain people in men's rooms call you the Cavaleiro Stan Herman 16:16 I have told me about the cooking but I I'm convinced that the Jewish mother thing about mothers being good cooks is is hogwash. My mother's a lousy cook. She always was a lousy cook. She cooks the same thing over and over again. lousier I think the lovely lady. She's a lovely lady, but a lousy cook. I come home on a Friday night for dinner and it's it's pot roast and it's so thin. And I tried to tell her how to make it Dan Greenburg 16:40 But it's very tender right? David Susskind 16:46 Do you have your secrecies that you think that came out of your boyhood out of your mother's supervision? Stan Herman 16:52 Oh, probably Sure, didn't we? Oh, I think so. Mel Brooks 16:59 But you do tend It's true. That's a very good point. You do tend to emulate characteristics of your mother subliminally without realizing it. For instance, I'm sure that Stan's mother had a mustache some otherwise why Stan Herman 17:14 She was born. She was born in January, which is a mustache month. Mel Brooks 17:18 I didn't know that. I thought it was I thought it was the month of the tiger to tell you the truth. David Susskind 17:23 Do you have little phobias little Mel Brooks 17:25 Do you want to see them? David Susskind 17:30 Do you have eccentricities that you you know lay at the doorstep. boyhood experiences. Mel Brooks 17:35 I was in analysis six years, and I could not launch a decent attack against my mother. I like my mother. I love my mother. If I could. I would go skinny dipping with my mother. I'm crazy about that lady, good natured, bright, fierce little woman that came over from Russia didn't speak the language never learned this language never learned Russian. Anyone talks like this. And yet gets to everywhere she wants to go she's a fantastic David Susskind 18:10 How does she do it? Well, even when she gets on a on a subway Mel Brooks 18:15 she gets on the subway. She says to the conductor. I'm writing my son. you know my television. She tells the conductor you know by Mel Brooks. She tells everybody David Susskind 18:30 that gets her to Brighton. Mel Brooks 18:32 Yes. Well, Mel Brooks, you must want to go to Kings Road right. You know the most Myron Cohn has influenced me more than my mother. Why? Because the two sides of me that do different things. Mel Brooks that strange amalgam marvelous pastiche that is me David Susskind 18:51 to describe the comes from the two sides Mel Brooks 18:57 Well the first side Sir Anthony Right. Clearly, Myron Cohen tells a joke he starts off like Anthony. There's not a trace, not a scintilla not the end of a Jewish accent. You don't know he's Jewish till he hits the joke. Right. Now, David, when he starts out he doesn't he doesn't like this right Myron Cohen. picture if you will. Right. Here we go. There were two gentlemen. Robert Hebraic persuasion who encountered each other on the reality one gentleman said to the other something about boarding public conveyance. And so both of them got on board of tram or bus. I don't really know what you call it. I don't know what you call it in the United States. And they were riding down one of the morvelous boulevards you have here in your lovely city, and one of the Jewish gentlemen turned to the other and said me It's good to practice to different people. Right? Right. You don't know he's Jewish until that Vbus David Susskind 20:07 what's the other part of you? Mel Brooks 20:09 And the other part of you is just a lot of Fred Astaire. You think I'm kidding? I'll show you a little. I'm puttin' on my white tie, tying up my black tie putting on my yarmulke David Susskind 20:39 you're a dead ringer for Astaire your ringer? Yeah, they have to do the Fred Astair story. Mel Brooks 20:46 You're crazy. David Susskind 20:48 Yes. And we'll be back in a minute

INTERVIEW BEGINS: David Steinberg 2:39 Jewish mothers let's talk about sharks. Mel Brooks 2:44 Sharks sharks. This shark will never harm you. The shark is a benign creature of the sea. Of course, if you're thrashing about in the water, or if you're wearing shiny bracelets the shark will be attracted to you. on occasion the shark has followed people out of the water and has gone to the blanket and eaten their beach ball. One time the shark followed my brother Irving home on the Brighton local. And when upon being admitted to the apartment house, the shark entered his apartment apartment 4B and ate his entire family and a brand new hat in my brother's closet. Apart from that the shark, the shark. Shark. Shark is a pussy cat. we got to get back to Jewish mother. Let me tell you about my mother, my Jewish mother. She's about that thing. She's the Michael John of mother's fantastic mother. I have never seen to this day I live with my mother for good 22 years intimately. You know. I have never seen my mother's furniture to this day. Why? Because on every piece of furniture and on the lamps is a sheet to keep the dust right to keep dust off the furniture. But what really is criminal is that my mother has four great paintings, which we've never seen. We don't know what they are. He has a sheet over each paint. David Susskind 4:31 She sounds like a very Mel Brooks 4:33 and how about your mom? David Susskind 4:35 She's She's lovely. I'll come to her Mel Brooks 4:37 She's a pussycat and she does the kavat David Susskind 4:40 Do you have any throbbing memories of your mother, Dan? Dan Greenburg 4:45 Most of them are throbbing and filled with guilt. David Susskind 4:48 What is the nature of a Jewish mother? She's special. You wrote a book about the Jewish mom. Dan Greenburg 4:53 Yes, Well, the Jewish mother I think is an expert on instilling guilt into people and manipulating it in and so on my own mother when I came back for the first time, from moving to New York to Chicago, and was telling about the the wildlife in New York and was remarking to a bunch of the family about a party at which was smoke marijuana, and my mother kind of remained impassive throughout the whole thing. And then afterwards, she came up to me and she said, this, marijuana you, you smoked it. I said, Oh, no. She said Good. Because you know how allergic you are? David Susskind 5:34 She wasn't upset. Or the party, the women where you will come from Kansas City. Yes. How our mothers out there? Larry Goldberg 5:43 Well, Jewish people in Kansas City go underground. You know, like in New York, all the Gentiles are Jewish. So in Kansas City, so all the Jewish people are Gentile. So we had a little grocery store Goldbergs market, she used to tell me to eat and eat until I started putting a lot of weight. But you know, Jewish people in Kansas City, as soon as the doors closed, they really become Jewish. I kept eating and eating until she said, stop eating for a while. And then I weighed 320 pounds. So David Susskind 6:09 You really did? 320 pounds from your mother's instruction. Larry Goldberg 6:14 Yeah. But then I started losing now I'm 160. But she just had kept keep eating and eating and eating. David Susskind 6:20 Well you look terrific. Larry Goldberg 6:23 I don't feel so good. David Susskind 6:25 You're currently starring in Where's Papa? George Segal 6:27 Yes, sir. David Susskind 6:27 In which you try to do away with your mother by a variety of means. George Segal 6:31 Yes David Susskind 6:32 some physical and violent? George Segal 6:33 Yes. David Susskind 6:35 Did you have any particular identification with that part? George Segal 6:38 complete, complete. It has nothing to do with my mother, Ruth Gordon. Right. Well, actually, Ruth Gordon has something to do with my mother, but the character that she plays has nothing to do with the character that my mother plays. David Susskind 6:52 Right? Could you explain that? George Segal 6:58 It is the story of of a man who's trying who's still at 38 or whatever. Still living with his mother, which I assume is a mother's dream. Mel Brooks 7:08 A mother's dream is to be under the huppa with you. David Susskind 7:12 No, no, no, no, please. No, no, no, this is this is television. Mel Brooks 7:17 Just explain what the huppa is. It's not dirty. If you're a Jew, you'd understand David. David Susskind 7:24 Go ahead Mel Brooks 7:24 If you hadn't segwayed out so early. A huppa is a little kind of tent that is held by four people, usually the immediate family. They're invited to the eats later. And under under this tent, you are married and are in an Orthodox Jewish ceremony. So when I said your mother would like to be under the huppa, she'd really like to be wed on to you. That's all I mean. David Susskind 7:45 Oh, I thought it was worse than that. Mel Brooks 7:47 It's not under the sheets under the huppa David Susskind 7:52 Did the character you played. It was such a clinging suffocating George Segal 7:57 Why are you looking past me David Susskind 8:00 Sorry. All right, George. Yes, Mel Brooks 8:02 He has a bad David Susskind 8:05 mother, Ruth Gordon. Yes. was such a suffocating wretched lady. Yes. Is that characteristic of the Jewish mother? George Segal 8:14 Well, I am not a thought on authority on the Jewish mother. I after all grew up in Great Neck. I had a dog a collie dog, which is a gentle thing to have. I had a 24 inch bike, and I rode around the neighborhood with the dog. So I didn't eat much and she didn't care. So I'm not an authority. Mel Brooks 8:35 Wait a minute a 20 a 24 inch bike. That's a short. That's a short 24 was called No 24 inches. George Segal 8:46 I always had a 24 bike even when I was 18 Mel Brooks 8:50 That must be the size of the wheels. I mean, the whole bike can't be 24 inches David Susskind 8:57 I think we're all we're all off on a digression Stan Herman 9:00 I had a 28 and I'm like 4 foot 2 David Susskind 9:04 Stan Herman you are how tall Stan Herman 9:06 I am five foot two, three, and I had a 28 bike that's been a problem for me. stretching my legs Mel Brooks 9:12 and chafing. Stan Herman 9:12 Yes. David Susskind 9:16 Stan, Stan Herman 9:16 yes. David Susskind 9:18 How does your mother feel about your being a fashion designer? mothers don't rear their sons to be fashion designers Stan Herman 9:23 no they don't. She's got lots of relatives who love it though. They live very close by she she accepted now I'm very successful. She accepted You see David I had two mothers my first mother gave me piano lessons gave me all the artistic things that I wanted. My second mother decided to take the piano out and as Mel said we had a small house mell and upstairs David Susskind 9:25 not 24 inches Stan Herman 9:40 No but we had we had a we had a like a small chamber that she came up so she took off the doors so that it looks bigger. My bedroom had no doors. Have you ever slept in that doors? Mel Brooks 9:56 That's so that you don't do private things Stan Herman 9:58 that's right that's what it's all about right? And on top of that, she took the lock off the John door I spend my whole life like this against the jon door George Segal 10:08 Did you ever talk about this with her? Stan Herman 10:10 No, I'm telling her now over television. George Segal 10:14 You never discussed you have to do it here on a television. Stan Herman 10:17 I had to do it on a television show. David Susskind 10:18 stan, did you ever say Mom, wouldn't it be nice to have a bathroom door? Stan Herman 10:23 No, she we didn't have the door. We had David we have the door. We didn't have the lock. I don't know whether there was a lock problem in Passaic New Jersey. But, but we just didn't. We just didn't have the lock on the door David Susskind 10:32 Did it tend to open? Stan Herman 10:34 It tend to open all the time. The most embarrassing moments. David Susskind 10:37 So you never had a normal? Stan Herman 10:38 No, no, no, no, no doors, no locks, David Susskind 10:41 right. I'm coming right back to David Steinberg after this pause

INTERVIEW RESUMES: David Susskind 30:47 are you is your single condition the fact that we're on again, David? Are you single because Mel Brooks 30:53 a little boy's room but everything was too small? David Susskind 30:57 Are you Are you single because you're frightened of the Jewish princess? David Steinberg 31:03 No I'm not frightened of the Jewish. I happen to be the Roger Vadim to Jewish girl. David Susskind 31:11 What does that me? David Steinberg 31:12 I don't know. Mel Brooks 31:14 Very good. I know. George Segal 31:17 Congratulations, David Susskind 31:19 Could you explaing it in a way that we can live with. George Segal 31:21 No way I can explain that. David Susskind 31:23 Could you explain it in a way that would keep us alive? What does being the Roger Vadim have Jewish princesses Mel Brooks 31:34 means that many Jewish girls seek his attention. That's what it means. It's as simple as that. Well, they would like to run barefoot through his hair David Susskind 31:46 But part of the Jewish Princess syndrome is grabbing the man and making merry right? David Steinberg 31:51 Yes, but they also get the sense that I was born with the gift of laughter in a sense that the world is mad. Mel Brooks 31:58 And besides it again, again they get the sense David Steinberg 32:04 they get I couldn't do that again. But gift the laughter Yes, the I don't see I have anything to do with with the Jewish girl your Jewish girl. David Susskind 32:12 Do you have anything to do with your average Gentiles? David Steinberg 32:14 Well, it's hard to bring a Gentile girl home to a Jewish family what you do is you bring home a black girl first David Susskind 32:24 breaking the ice David Steinberg 32:26 You bring home a Gentile girl and then you come on say Mary Smith David Susskind 32:36 seriously, have you brought have you brought Gentile ladies into your household? your father being a rabbi. Mel Brooks 32:49 You don't want a Jewish religion if you're going with a Jewish girl if you're just engaged to her and your break off, you still pay alimony. Illegal that's legal. Sure three kisses and alimony alimony. It's not a lot. There was a token token David Susskind 33:08 a percent of you in your bachelor you must have paid a lot of alimony. Mel Brooks 33:11 Oh in my bachelorhood did I pay alimony? There was a girl in Scranton I gotta tell you she had a leg better than my entire brother ravings. I don't want to talk about didn't want to hear but she was so skinny the way they said check your umbrella against me David Susskind 33:32 let's say you're single your Stan Herman 33:35 No, they don't they look at me. They see dresses. That's about what they see. But they see a successful designer who could possibly get them something wholesale. David Susskind 33:47 And you have no interest. Stan Herman 33:48 No, no, no. Mel Brooks 33:49 Yeah, the biggest I think Jewish girls biggest problem is the tip. They want you to have a modicum of knowledge. Yes, they do want you beneficence. They want to see a big tip. But then they want to see the waiter. Yeah, they want to see your takeout like, Yeah, let's say the meal is $38.42 with tax. they want you to put about $7 down for the waiter. And then they'll say leave him two but they want to see that seven go out. So you know like they know you have it like that. The attitude but not the actual real payment and money. Are you looking? David Susskind 34:21 How is it you weren't trapped with all your vigor with making Mel Brooks 34:26 blue marks on my legs. David Susskind 34:29 But look at all the princesses you know you were 23 by your own confession. Mel Brooks 34:33 I gave them all a telephone David Susskind 34:35 You gave them all a telephone. But um, but um, but they could have married Mel Brooks, the writer on the Sid Caesar show making 5000 a week and brought him home to mom and Papa. Mel Brooks 34:43 That would be fainting and joy in the house celebration. David Susskind 34:47 How did you keep loose and elusive? Mel Brooks 34:49 I would say when you get out of the car. David Susskind 34:53 Then that could do it right. After a long intimate relationship. You get out of the car Mel Brooks 35:01 Jewish girls are the same as any girls. They're no good. Dangerous that trouble and always in the shower. Always in the shower later, the fantastic regret that permeate your system that pervades your soul. The why that the why that gushes forth from the deepest recesses of your being. Why did I do it? Why? And what am I going to say to her now? I light a cigarette, and we'll talk about Charlie Barnett What am I gonna say? Now but it's over now that the passion is gone. All girls. There's nothing to say to later. David Susskind 35:46 Yeah Do you have any you have any memories of the Jewish princesses previous to Nora Dan Greenburg 35:59 I, as a matter of fact, I was going out with a Jewish Princess when I was at UCLA. And I couldn't believe it that this gorgeous looking rich Jewish girl was going out with this funny looking creep from Chicago fellow with glasses was skinny, played a guitar silly person. And then one night she invited me to a party and I came in and there were six beautiful Jewish princesses all identical there were six funny looking guys with glasses playing guitar David Susskind 36:30 they run too tight. David Steinberg 36:31 You see David even though by by not by trying to avoid the Jewish Princess, you can get into the other Pitfall, which is you look for Vogue magazine type girls with their with cheekbones two feet above their head. THat's the other kind Mel Brooks 36:47 Concave chests David Steinberg 36:48 inverted chest. And this kind of gives you the impression that they are very sophisticated you know they you've discussed the Vivaldi with them and and you can discuss the early works of Paul clay and you can discuss the pro music and Tiguan when you get home they send you a copy of your good man Charlie Brown. And that's a whole different call. You get suckered into that, Mel Brooks 37:14 by the way, David Susskind 37:15 Are there different lifestyles between the Jewish girls and the non Jewish groups as far as the war the man pursuer concern. David Steinberg 37:23 I think so. Yeah, I think just as there there are differences between the Jew and Gentile depends how you're brought up. I think girls I don't think you can you can't lump girls and that's in fact what the women's liberation thing is so it's so good about rightly so right can keep on talking about girls like therapy infusing Mel Brooks 37:42 exactly like they were different creatures or they're not David Steinberg 37:49 They are Different creatures Mel Brooks 37:50 Yes. Girls are our people just as you and I even that even even defining it that way is negative and rather chauvinistic. We shouldn't make such a big fuss about about the fact that girls are girls and boys are boys, you know, except Except sexually, because that's a lot of fun. But apart from that, it's it's really silly and rather antique to think of women as different human beings are different creatures. My favorite human be people have been Oh, my have been women. I they have been. By far, brighter, and better gooder than most men that I have. No. Seriously, I did business Stan Herman 38:37 with I did ladies more than they're brilliant. They're bright. Mel Brooks 38:41 They are better looking. Yeah. Who wants to look at a guy all night? David Susskind 38:45 Is that? Is that a Cuban cigar? George Segal 38:47 I think so. It's a gift. Stan Herman 38:51 It only goes in that direction. David Susskind 38:54 No, I was wondering all evening and only have you liked it. Oh, it's lovely. Yes. Aromatic. George Segal 38:59 It is. It's nice smelling cigar. Mel Brooks 39:01 If you want to look at another question here. David Susskind 39:05 Now we're about to close. Do you have anything left? You'd like to get off your chest in a minute? Anything? Mel Brooks 39:10 I have not? I am I'm spoken out. I have nothing to say. We get no money. A dollar we get for the two hours right? I can do a club date at the hotel or low. I could have $2500 now Good evening, ladies and germs. Like I'm telling you what's in my heart. Never nothing. David Steinberg 39:31 Takes a long time to be sitting right. You know, I feel I should have been busier than this Mel Brooks 39:34 I mean, if this. Were a party and we weren't on the end we just met. I mean, we would have left already. David Susskind 39:45 I gotta tell you, I've never had more fun ever. This movie is the 12 chairs and it's quite marvelous and got rave notices his movie Well which one you want? Where's Papa has just opened It's sensational. It's a wild black, outrageous, funny, funny comedy and the Owl and the Pussycat unknown lady named Barbra Streisand. His new album on Electra David Steinberg 40:10 David Steinberg, disguised as a normal person, David Susskind 40:12 David Steinberg, and by his dresses and read his books, he made pizza. Pizza, and thank you, we'll be right back

INTERVIEW RESUMES: David Susskind 20:52 Listen, we've agreed you're gonna call his mother and then you're gonna try to make contact with the Steinberg folks Mel Brooks 20:58 right behind the Capitol, Buddy Hackett. You're David Susskind 20:59 right, buddy, buddy. What was growing up like in terms of could you date non Jewish girls? Was that tolerated? No, you were in high school college. Dan Greenburg 21:10 I was engaged to a non Jewish girl and my parents really, I really have to hand it to him. They really were terrific. They and there was a lot there was a little trembling at first, but they really, they got they were wonderful. And then we broke up and then I got engaged to Nora and there was such a feeling of relief. They class per to their bosom bosoms. Both bosoms. And they really, they love her so much. They love her more than me. But I can understand that she's a lot more attractive, lovable person who knew her and I a certain amount of their anger. Yes, no, but I think I think it's terrific. And no, what was your question? David Susskind 21:47 Were your folks strict Mel in terms of who you could see and how late you could stay up, be home by Mel Brooks 21:53 no, but you had a smack that mezuzah on away. I'm gonna explain what? Well, they're actually the Torah, or the most significant, I think it's the 10 commandments actually are written in a little tiny scroll. They're put into this little metal house. And this little metal housing is screwed in or nailed into the side of a door. And you kiss that on the way in more or less blesses your house. Or at least there is some deference paid to the fact that it is a sanctified place. Mel Brooks 21:53 It's to symbolize the time when, when the 10 plagues occurred in Egyptian time, they had to rub up blood on the doorposts so that the angel of death would pass by the Jewish homes because they were living. So it's a symbol of that. David Susskind 22:49 I'm glad you right on. George Segal 22:51 Well, that's the first time I've heard that. We didn't have a mezuzah. We just had a door David Susskind 23:01 they were no doors. I do. But with with all the strictness of your mother she said, Mel go out tonight. Enjoy yourself come home at any hour. I mean, you were given that kind of license Mel Brooks 23:12 She was so busy cleaning, washing floors, oil cloth. I mean, there was no pattern anymore. They were just what she cleaned. The morning tonight. She'd fold blank. I mean, the bedding I mean their little Tarzan's their little King Kong Z's Jewish ladies then they're all Jewish sinew, they wrapped mattresses and they turn they put them out the window. They spray the the kill the bedbugs. The cleaning can killing until they die themselves. They clean and kill. They are they are incredibly fantastic. Monumental people. Jewish mothers, I'm in mind. They are incredible people David Susskind 23:55 with money. It was a problem in all your household. David Steinberg 23:58 Yes they it was never a problem that it Mel Brooks 24:01 The problem was in defining the coinage. Right, but there was no money. So we didn't know what a nickel are, you know? Well, David Steinberg 24:07 we were never we were never wealthy but we never dealt with money. My father would go back and forth between the rabbinit and the grocery business depending upon which was more lucrative. And he always seemed to be missing out on which one it was. We lived I lived most of my life above the grocery store. And I there was an attic that I lived in and my brother and I slept in the same bed and there used to be I think it was raspberries on the wallpaper that I used to see every night. Then one day Mel Brooks 24:38 Is it funny to look at raspberries and smell herrings David Steinberg 24:41 but they they used to cheer me up used to think that as a kid as nine years old, I need a morale boost to tell me that we were moving and they take off the raspberries and put football players on the on the wallpaper really nice to come home and it was like a new house for me. That was everything was on a different level. You know David Susskind 24:56 Did you have to work for your spending money you have to get to David Steinberg 24:59 No that's the other thing is I always seem to have as much money as I needed. I just never thought about big dates and things like that. Mel Brooks 25:08 I guess we will. I don't know, I was poor, poverty stricken. But we never I don't think I realized it when I was a kid David Susskind 25:17 Did they ever go on welfare? Did they ever go Mel Brooks 25:19 no, no. I mean, for some reason there was there was a level a threshold of dignity that could not be broken. And going on relief was that was it you could not? There was something irreligious about David Steinberg 25:31 this. This curiously enough. If my mother was watching, this would be the thing that she would be embarrassed by the fact that I would say that we were poor, even though there's no hang up about it. You still are. It depends. First generation or second generation Jews. The I'm first generation my my mother and father came over from Russia, because I was in Canada, and there was a later immigration even I'm 28 years old. And so what happens is, there's still a feeling of always being a stranger in this land. And that never changes. It changed a little bit with me and maybe more with my children, but to my mother and to my family, they are still don't have their roots into the earth. So that you don't talk about how poor you are, as you want to adjust, even though there's no emphasis on the money. David Susskind 26:20 How well you did, you had more money than Dan Greenburg 26:24 my my parents? Were always teachers. I mean, teachers aren't to your wealthy citizens. My father taught art in in the high schools. And my mother always taught Hebrew. And so I mean, we had an entirely different lifestyle than Mel Brooks 26:44 If they got together, they could be Shegal David Susskind 26:48 Can I ask you about a myth about? Many women feel that Jewish men make the best husbands? Is there anything than that? Mel Brooks 26:54 That's the stark Naked Truth? Larry Goldberg 26:57 Yeah, but they play around with anybody they can? Mel Brooks 27:01 Oh, no, no, I think Jewish husbands are constant, constantly fooling around? David Susskind 27:08 No, is there something to that proposition? And if they make Mel Brooks 27:12 What proposition David Susskind 27:14 That Jewish husbands make the best Jewish men make the best husbands Mel Brooks 27:18 a myth, a myth, a myth, a canard? And a bit of a conundrum. At this point, at this point, it would have been 68 down. Because there I mean, some Jewish husbands are terrific, and others are short and disgusting David Susskind 27:36 The proposition that givers they're generous, they're buyers. Mel Brooks 27:40 Nonsense, nonsense. David Susskind 27:42 Not a giver or a buyer Mel Brooks 27:44 I give nothing. I buy nothing. So I mean, you can't go by me. I won't take anywhere. David Susskind 27:50 But has Annie got lovely. Mel Brooks 27:52 Annie makes 100 a week? She doesn't need it. David Susskind 27:56 Would you occasionally Mel Brooks 27:58 Once in a while, I'll go crazy. I'll buy a pretzel with every bit of salt in tacked on it. No, I wanted to I mean, I I am out of the, I guess the normal way of Jewish husband life when we're both in this business in this crazy business, so but for the normal middle class or upper middle class, Jewish husband? I don't see any any any any special, higher moral way of being? David Susskind 28:28 It's a myth. A conard a conundrum, would you say George George Segal 28:32 that Jewish men make the best kind of husbands? Mel Brooks 28:36 You mean that the myth is that they deliver more, David Susskind 28:38 if they deliver more that they take anything? buy anything? I'll get you anything. George Segal 28:45 That's me. That's you anywhere. I'll take her anywhere, anywhere she wants to go. I'll take her Mel Brooks 28:50 And leave her there David Susskind 28:53 David, though you haven't taken on the marital bond, yet tend to be generous with members of the opposite sex. David Steinberg 29:00 What I was thinking more I think that the myth of Jewish men, I think that happens to be a myth other than Mel and George Quite obviously, but I think the Jewish Princess concept is very active and alive. David Susskind 29:14 What is the Jewish Princess queen? David Steinberg 29:15 Well, the Jewish purchases the daughter that's been spoiled and brought up by the parents and they never quite get out of it make spec their husbands to cater to them in the same way that the mother and father did. And they never outgrow that. Mel Brooks 29:29 It's true. As a matter of fact, it's codified. There are laws and rules, yes, governing that. If you meet a Jewish girl and shake her hand, that's dinner. If you should take her home after dinner and rub around and kiss in the doorway, right? That's already a small ring would be something if God forbid, anything filthy should happen amongst you. That's marriage and the same grave buried together. Yes they do expect a lot from them fooling around. David Susskind 30:07 Why? Why is that? Because did their parents say look nothing unless he married Mel Brooks 30:11 Because they said from the minute they're born little Jewish girl they say now Queen Elizabeth, please eat Yamato. Please eat another spoonful of sour cream. And little you see little Jewish girls with a crown don't get the Jewish ladies expect a lot for a little they do expect a lot and they deserve a lot because they're short waisted and teriffic in bed. David Susskind 30:39 We'll Be right back

INTERVIEW BEGINS: David Susskind 0:01 All right, David, we just had an education in the torah. Do you have anything to comment on? David Steinberg 0:06 Oh yes. When you were when you appear on the talk shows in a Jewish family, that's what I've seen in the nearly uninterrupted was that a doctor and a lawyer is less than appearing on a talk show. A Talk Show is like a Nobel Prize winner in a Jewish family. I mean, that's the epitome. And my family's very proud of me. The only time it caused any tension is I bought a Volkswagen when I was at college. And that immediately set everyone off. And I realized that I had myself I had, I had a fear of Volkswagens. From childhood, I am this fear that wouldn't it be weird , made all of the Volkswagens are going to drive all the Jews back to Germany. And I got rid of it, because it was placed in my head by my family was something that would ordinarily think about kind of interim conversation that David Susskind 0:54 that's a what kind of a relationship do you have with your mothers now? Do you see them regularly? Do you write frequently? George Segal 1:02 I see her regularly. I see her once, maybe twice a week. I'm having lunch with her tomorrow. David Steinberg 1:09 Can we come? George Segal 1:11 No. No. David Susskind 1:13 Other words with that kind of regularity? It presupposes a good relationship. I mean, you like each other? George Segal 1:18 Yes. Is your mother? David Susskind 1:21 No. extent? Yes. She's quite alive George Segal 1:23 Is she here in the city? David Susskind 1:25 Yes, yes. George Segal 1:25 Do you see her? Dan Greenburg 1:26 Yes I do, quite frequently George Segal 1:27 About how many times a week would you say? David Susskind 1:30 Well, a one and a half times a week. George Segal 1:34 Do you have her up or you go to her place, David Susskind 1:36 No most of the time she prefers to visit so she can see the grandchildren. David Susskind 1:40 Does she get along with your wife. David Steinberg 1:41 Oh, yes. Extremely well, George Segal 1:45 Where did you grow up? David Steinberg 1:47 I grew up in George Segal 1:48 No no, just let me ask you questions because we see week after week we hear we don't know anything about you. You are asking us as if you don't have a Jewish mother. David Susskind 1:59 No, I do. I do. I confess it with great pride, Mel Brooks 2:03 What do you give her David? How much a month. Enough to get by. Is she happy with what you give her. David Susskind 2:17 thrilled thrilled George Segal 2:19 Did you grow up in the city here. David Susskind 2:20 No come from Brookline Massachusetts. Now could could we push on today? Are you seeing a lot? A lot of your mother Mel Brooks 2:26 do you like your mother? I my mother just moved down to Miami Beach. So I don't hear it as often as I'd love to. But I do call her quite often and I try to you know, fly down at least once a month and say hello. I liked my mother very much. I love her. She's groovy she's good natured. She has a jaunty jolly way and a sense of humor i i owe a lot to Iowa $1,100. Like and she's not she was never as never been an oppressive force in my life. She's she's been quite the opposite. She's always been buoyant and uplifting. And David Susskind 3:07 she still kind of did regulate your life a little for example, would once it was when you're getting married once you find a nice girl right Mel Brooks 3:14 No, in no way ever No, no, no manners. David Susskind 3:17 She didn't want that. Mel Brooks 3:18 No, She. someone said on the pannel. Was it you, Dan said about being happy. You should only be happy or some was it you? George Segal 3:28 I'll say my mother. Mel Brooks 3:32 But anyway, she wants me to she she would like very much for me to be happy. And David Susskind 3:36 today, she accepts you. She's got her head out of the oven. She's happy with your choice. Mel Brooks 3:41 She loves Annie and she. She's very proud of what I do. She thinks my film is grand. George Segal 3:45 Which film is that? Mel Brooks 3:46 It's called My Tant Hannah's tish. That's my aunt. Hannah's tablecloth. By the way, a strange thing about Jewish mothers. My mother does not have a particularly Jewish accent. She came here from Russia when she was a child. And her influences Irish because the only people who spoke English in the United States or in New York at that time, the only people who were the teachers, firemen, the police, the administration was Irish. And so my mother and my uncles and aunts have a vague Irish accent like my mother will say watch all right now all right, baby. I'm all right. Just a little thing am I shy? But it's true now I'm overdoing it. Okay. It's a kind of New York East you know, kind of Metropolitan little brushstroke of Jewish and David Susskind 4:47 what does it sound like in truth? Mel Brooks 4:49 Oh, my son. What are you talking about? Are you talking my son? He's taps and taps. Now that's Irish tops and he's taps and taps is pretty. Oh, he gives any does And what does he do? He dances he runs he walks. David Susskind 5:02 Sounds a little melancholy. Mel Brooks 5:05 He's terrific. The TS is terrific. So she doesn't have you know, the kind of stranger you know, amalgam of accents. David Susskind 5:14 Have you been in psychiatry six years Mel Brooks 5:16 always David Susskind 5:18 Psychiatry for you, Dan? Dan Greenburg 5:19 Of course. Stan Herman 5:22 I was just gonna say about relationships with with my mother I am. I think I mentioned to you, David, a book was written about Me About About six months ago. And that was a hard thing for to take. It's hard for mother to see herself in a book. It wasn't about me. I was not fiction. And I was not the it wasn't exactly the story of my life. But I would it was built around a designer on Seventh Avenue, more or less about me. And the family unit. Were there very much there. And it was a hard thing. For her to see herself in the book. Not a thing was like her nothing. Nothing David Susskind 5:56 She didn't recognize. But it was actually her. Well, it was a Stan Herman 5:58 Well, it was a part of her. Yes, it was and that was a big thing for me that for her and for me to see herself in print. It's a strange book was called Mr. Jack and the green stalks Mel Brooks 6:07 Mr. Jack and the Green Stalks. Stan Herman 6:09 good book. Mel Brooks 6:10 I think I heard of it. Yeah. Stan Herman 6:12 No, no, no, but it was a good it's a good book. It's gonna be called the velvet jungle in paperback. Mel Brooks 6:19 a Seventh Avenue design to think about, yes, think about the appropriation of words. A Seventh Avenue designer. We're gonna make Seventh Avenue, eight storeys high. We're gonna turn it at 38th Street. We're gonna curve it a 39. Stan Herman 6:36 It's as opposed to a Broadway design? You know, it's, it's just a garment said, you know, Seventh Avenue. Two distinct areas Broadway and Seventh Avenue. Seventh Avenue is legit. Broadway is the big those are the big moneymakers. Those are the handlers. Those are the guys who go out there and knock off Avenue as opposed to seventh avenue Mel Brooks 6:54 I mean, like you cut like a Stan Herman 6:55 I cut 20 of a style, they cut 2000. Mel Brooks 6:58 Now we're talking. see. and you cut fancy goods, I know patterns. And they cut solid, solid brown solid. Right, right. Right, right. Absolutely. David Susskind 7:10 How Did she feel when she read about the peculiar lifestyles? Stan Herman 7:15 Well she I go back to what David said she doesn't understand. doesn't talk about that. doesn't talk about those things at all. David Steinberg 7:23 My my mother loves my new record. David Susskind 7:28 What's it called? What's the name of the record, David? David Steinberg 7:31 It's on Electra. And it's called David Steinberg disguised as a normal person. And she Mel Brooks 7:38 doesn't she call it electric the truth David Steinberg 7:40 My mom also doesn't have an accent. She was raised by Ukrainians. So she speaks worse than you would if you had a Yiddish accent David Susskind 7:48 What does she sound like? David Steinberg 7:50 I'm not good at inflection I am gonna make towards the Myron cone reformed temple style of talking. No, I I get a stutter when I start to speak with a Yiddish accent. My mother was only interested in celebrities. She wants to know what is Sidney Poitier like? What is Barbara Streisand? More or less the same relationship with my mother that it verbally that that George had in Where's Papa with his mother? I try to shock her all the time because nothing shocks her. You know? She says what is Mike Douglas like? I say Mom, he's a wonderful man. Imagine how shocked I was to find him before each show shooting up sometimes she believes Mel Brooks 8:44 she's maybe a captain. David Susskind 8:47 Are you gonna tell her about this appear? David Steinberg 8:49 I haven't decided yet. I haven't decided what David Susskind 8:55 another question? Okay. Do you tell your mother stories? Mel Brooks 9:03 Do you have a name? Do you have a song? Like here? I am my Melvin. No, I don't. I've come to stop the show. Just to handle his mind his looks and your hearts. I'll grow. Do you have George Segal 9:13 I have no song like that? No, I never had a song Mel Brooks 9:15 You got one now. My name is George Segal. They say I'm regal. They say I'm selling regal shoes. I know. I know a lot of Jews. We could do a lot with that name. Yes. How about Susskind? My name is David Susskind. I think I'm very funny. I think I will sign bird that's the fine bird. That's the Weinberg, Ohio of Jews David Susskind 9:50 We'll be back in a minute.

BACK IN STUDIO - INTERVIEW CONTINUES: David Susskind 20:49 before pushing on, I can't help wondering before you became famous celebrity how did your mother get to brighten up gentlemen were on. Before you became an international celebrity Mel Brooks 20:49 By the way, did you read Judith Christie? review of the 12 chairs? The lowest salaries? Oh, yes, I did. Yeah, it was lousy, wasn't it? Now she gave us a very good review. She said it was a complete joy. And she said that I am. I'm the best thing that ever happened to film I did everything on that picture possible everything. I put them Sprockets at the side of the film, say the projectionists could thread it up. David Susskind 21:39 Your modesty is overpowered Mel Brooks 21:41 I lead you to your seat. You can see me there.Right to your seat. I wish you a good time and a hearty appetite. You bet chewing about David Susskind 21:54 I was wondering, before you became a world figure of renown. How did your mother your mother get how did your mother get to where she was going? Mel Brooks 22:05 I don't know what you mean. David Susskind 22:07 She couldn't speak the language. She Mel Brooks 22:09 just a little Jewish aggression. She pushed away through as a matter of fact. My mother lives in Miami now. And she just moved down and I said Are you afraid? You know, it's a completely different environment. Your children are not there. You don't have enough relatives. You know, I know that. It's fraught with people of your persuasion mom. But still, I mean, aren't you, you know, fight and scared. She said I came from Russia. That was a move already. From Russia to the United States. From New York to Florida. There's not such a big move. I mean, it's you know, so she really is a gutsy little Jewish lady. You know, she's a marvelous person. You know, my father died when he was 34. Dan. And my mother raised four, four boys sent us off to college. did a fantastic job. David Susskind 23:05 Is your mother alive at the moment? Does she visit you often from Kansas City? Larry Goldberg 23:10 Well, she took a long schlep up to see me in Kansas from Kansas City was about a 30 hour train ride. She was afraid to fly. She came in the pizzeria and she didn't touch the pizza. You know when in truth. It's not true. We have locks Goldilocks pizza locks and onions. Really Goldilocks Goldilocks pizza locks. We have a heart shaped feel about you're running a pizzeria. She doesn't talk a lot about it. I mean, I'm sure she'd rather me be a doctor lawyer. Mel Brooks 23:36 Why did she say she said my son's in food? Larry Goldberg 23:41 No, she says my son works in New York and he's a pizza schleper Mel Brooks 23:44 A pizza schleper George Segal 23:48 what's it like in Kansas City? Mel Brooks 23:51 everything's up to date in Kansas City. well, they've gone about as far David Steinberg 23:57 Do they have a ghetto there? Larry Goldberg 23:59 no the Jews I said there's only 23,000 Jews who everybody Gentile I didn't meet a Jew till I was 25 is not because they're spread out over about 800 miles in Kansas City. I'm a hillbilly Mel Brooks 24:10 I'll bet they together during pogroms. One big jew seller watch the Gentiles thunder by David Susskind 24:26 One of the things one of the things I wondered about in his book is that section devoted to that moment in time when a Jewish mother discovers her son is engaged or about to make a commitment to you that's one of the tragic moments in the Jewish mother's life isn't Dan Greenburg 24:42 Yeah well it's time for a complete about face I mean for the preceding in my case 30 years it's so when you're ready you know it's really and then the moment comes and and you introduce your intended to her and she says it's very nice, very nice girl. A lot of makeup wears a lot of makeup. She drinks I noticed she was drinking, drink before. I have nothing against drinking. Don't get me wrong, but I did see notice she was putting it away. I did notice you were putting it in. My mother is amazed that I will have a drink or two before dinner. And as a matter of fact, when we come Chicago to visit them, she will I'm now married to Nora Ephron Greenberg. She calls herself Nora Ephron. But actually she's my friend Greenberg. And she will say to my wife, am I talking to you? If you don't know me? No. This is George Segal. Yeah, she does know that. I don't know how she feels about that. But she will say to my wife, when I'm out of earshot. Is Dan still drinking? Does he drink a lot? Is it a problem? But anyway? What was your question David Susskind 25:56 The reaction of the Jewish David Steinberg 25:57 I haven't answered any question. David Susskind 26:02 David. When you? Are you married? David Steinberg 26:06 No, I'm not. David Susskind 26:06 Have you ever been engaged? David Steinberg 26:08 No, I haven't i i play around, you know. Fairly easy. I have to be asked. And that's pretty much it. But I want to talk about my mother. Yes. David Susskind 26:19 How old are you? David Steinberg 26:20 I'm 28. Yeah, the thing about my mother that you all care is my mother spoke Russian in Yiddish only in the house. And we're a very poor family. We came from very poor family now. Lately, it's been kind of nice to me. And I send a little money home. My mother doesn't speak English and she doesn't know any words. But now in the Yiddish you start to hear filtering through words like is that a network show?Today when I was in California, just yesterday, she said something totally in Yiddish and the end of the sentence was visa gates and the residual understands those things and she learns to adapt although Mel Brooks 27:11 they do throw in and that is yiddish you know when she was spoken in Russia I'm sure they pick up some Russian words and poland the same and and in New York you hear it Haagen often subway Yeah, suddenly, you know, it's true that you get a smattering of a different language George Segal 27:26 Are you both fluent in Yiddish? Mel Brooks 27:32 I used to work in the Fourth Circuit as a as a an MC in a pool David Susskind 27:36 thats how you started so I was just so I learned Mel Brooks 27:39 but you're talking about David Susskind 27:40 what's it like being an MC Mel Brooks 27:41 shut up David? Got a heavy Jews, it got dynamite here. Okay, when I when I introduced my mother to my present wife who was not Jewish, I said, David Susskind 27:54 oh, there must have been an interesting Mel Brooks 27:55 yes, I said Mom, I want you to meet Annie and. And she knew that my wife was Catholic and not Jewish. And she said, sit down, make yourself comfortable. You know, take a piece of food and relax and now I'll be in the kitchen. My head will be in the oven. A big disaster. And then they came to know each other and my mother is head over heels in love with Annie in they are best friends David Susskind 28:21 His wife is one of the gracious beautiful talented and Ann Bancroft I mean Mel Brooks 28:27 It was nothing Did She convert you kidding. She don't have to convert she's a star. Yes, I converted I Brooks was I'll tell you why I converted I no longer a Jew. And I'll tell you the reason I'm no longer a Jew. Because when a Jew is in trouble when we when we panic, but we're in trouble. And we want to say, oh my god, I got Can you talk about you know, one of our expletives? And then we follow it with a sign. Now how are we going to follow it? Like if you're Catholic with like a Catholic says, oh my god, like you know, the right look of it. But what did you What do you come out? I mean, where do you go to triangle? That's a lot of work. By the time you're finished the second triangle? David Susskind 28:38 Yes, David. David Steinberg 29:21 I was just suggesting that we get off of Mel because he's so hot. Now. You don't want to see him fade right in front. So I thought if I made this gesture, perhaps I get the focus. I'll talk until I get to a point. Here is here's the point. The point is, what your mind is the curses in a Yiddish home are very, very special and especially the curses that you get from a mother. They're unlike anything that you get in a Gentile home. They're very specific, and they sucker you in so as to give you the impression that it's not a curse. They say May you inherit a huge estate and on that huge estate, have 100 mansions In 100 mentions 100 beds and may you flip from bed to bed with malarial fever lovely May a barracks grow in your stomach barracks and army barracks oh but funny but it works Mel Brooks 30:25 there is another one that says something about the true Jewish things lots of oxen Viet symbol if you cut into that David Steinberg 30:30 grow like an onion with your head in in the earth Mel Brooks 30:33 Alright now do this translate this okay zones to Esna trolley car David Steinberg 30:46 you should eat a trolley car and steal the transfers Mel Brooks 30:49 and steal the transfers actually add more to do with I believe David Susskind 30:56 We'll be back with translations of all of this in a minute

BACK IN STUDIO - INTERVIEW CONTINUES: David Susskind 42:44 You think? Fellas We're back. We're back on. Yeah. Okay. Did you think the Portnoy's Complaint was a fair? Fair characterization? Mel Brooks 42:55 Well, I think you know, I think it's an extension of truth. George Segal 43:00 Are there Jewish qualities in the 12 chairs. On the Jewish overlay Mel Brooks 43:05 chairs are Jewish to begin with. I mean, like the minute you come in, take a seat. There was something strange. There's something strange about a Jewish man of 67 Something weird, if I might add a Jewish man of 67 He's usually a father in law. You greet him at the door. It's raining. And you say, Dad, it's so good to see you. Why don't you come in? And he says No, I'm alright. I'm alright good. It's you came to see us it's raining Pa come on in. Come on. No, it's good here. Give me a coat and then come on in. Okay, how are you doing? I'm fine. I'm all right. I'm all right. All right. Sit down take the club chair. Good Standing here we ate in the car I noticed that strange thing with all they just they just don't want to be bothered. And so they overcompensate by being insane. And it's true David Susskind 44:07 Do you find that to be true in your memories. Your father came in quickly sat down began eating Dan Greenburg 44:14 no he was always there. I have nothing to say about this at all funny or serious or anything at all. David Susskind 44:20 Why the guys that are singl is that any kind of reaction against the Jewish mother David Steinberg 44:25 to stay single David Susskind 44:26 to stay single David Steinberg 44:27 No, no I used to say single because it's so much fun. Larry Goldberg 44:30 You havent't met the right girl. David Steinberg 44:31 I have Yeah. Many times I keep on looking she disappears. I know why single as a reaction no see what's good. It's a reaction to get married. You know? My father was a stronger figure in the family than my mother. See, my father was more liberal, liberal Jew and a more intelligent he accepted me more for what I was than my mother. He accept me for exactly what I was a punishment from God. My mother, my father, my mother used to hit me all the time. My mother was the hitter in the family always, never bothered me. Mel Brooks 45:08 When they hit you, they say, What are you? You're killing me David Steinberg 45:15 but my father used to do something that was more terrifying than everything. My brothers and I used to call it the Peggy Lee. He used to go. We couldn't hear what he said. And we knew that if he got us that was I never heard. Peggy Lee, you come in. I skipped school once for I think 28 days. And I gave my minor infraction. I gave my aunt Jessie a terminal disease. And I kept on elaborating on it. My father met me as I was coming out of the Odeon Theatre in Canada. And Toronto from Winnipeg Western, my eyes hadn't quite focused to the length, you know, I can include theater for 38 days, every afternoon. It tunes of glory, a very boring movie Seven or eight times because I'm going to the movies don't change. My eyes have been quite focused. And my father was at the back of the bus, you know, when I saw him and the way to get off of in the back of the bus and I burst into tears and the bus driver hadn't seen any of this brutality. But see, my father, father was very good. My father was also more liberal. My father used to say, if you if you don't eat kosher food, nothing happens. Your stomach drops out. It's up to you go out to the world. David Susskind 46:38 What kind of provocation would bring forth a hit from your mother? David Steinberg 46:42 I smile. More than I have some more rice with milk. I like your Kraft macaroni and cheese dinner for that 38 day in a row. That would get a hit. David Susskind 46:54 Was the violence the rule of your home? Stan Herman 46:57 Never No, not not nothing all of my home and for me, the designer know a Jewish designer in a Jewish household from New Jersey very close. It was a very strange thing you talked about. He talked about a mother or father sort of giving up on the sun. They went the other direction until the sun became successful. It was a hard scene for them. I mean, hard scene for them David Susskind 47:18 was a designer a terrible fall Stan Herman 47:21 is a terrible fall. He liked fabric. He he was he wasn't going to be a lawyer that was for sure. They didn't my parents never were strong about anything. They didn't say you couldn't do this. You couldn't do that. If you're happy. Do it but be successful at it make it a success. I grew up in this syndrome where if you weren't successful you just sort of beat yourself on the head fell flat on your face. David Steinberg 47:25 Yeah but that's a myth to about the lawyer in the account that no Jewish mother wants to send to be a lawyer want to be a singer like Tony Bennett? No to have that look and complete note no one wants a doctor or a lawyer anymore. That's an art Stan Herman 48:00 when I quit when Mike and my time they did want a doctor a lawyer they want or a fabric salesman. But not David Susskind 48:07 but George they must have wanted a doctor a lawyer in your house because to become an actor. George Segal 48:12 No, there are no doctors or lawyers in our house or in our family anywhere. David Susskind 48:17 Well, why would they despairing when you became an actor? What had they wished for you? George Segal 48:22 Well, my father had been was dead at that time. David Susskind 48:26 Your mother? Yes. My mother. Yeah. George Segal 48:28 Good question, please. Mel Brooks 48:30 I did father dying. I'm not doing that. I just you keep your father's death off the show. We had a death on the show. did very well. That's not refried David Susskind 48:44 What did your mother want you to be? George Segal 48:48 I have no idea. I think she wanted me to go to college and then and then go into the world I guess maybe debutante? That's elegant. David Steinberg 48:59 But now Now they're really proud of you. I mean, now. George Segal 49:03 My father has died. So it's just my mother. David Susskind 49:05 Why is the Jewish mother such a universal fair game for the novelist for the filmmaker for the comedian? Is she naturally funny? what Would you like to talk about Mel Brooks 49:28 take a chance. Larry Goldberg 49:31 My mother taught me how to clean my tush. That was she taught cleanliness in the home. She talked cleanliness and home how to use foot powder. The touch we cleaned. I call it the touch in the in the Midwest is to tokus tokens, the tokens. David Susskind 49:47 That's fascinating. George Segal 49:49 We're trying to elevate the level of the show right. Mel Brooks 49:54 going down. David Susskind 49:57 What did your mother what were her intentions David Steinberg 50:00 just go to dandy. David Susskind 50:03 When she dreamed her Russian dreams, Mel Brooks 50:05 what did she my mother took me out of Abraham Lincoln high school when I was about 15, and took me to Heron, High School of Aviation Trades. My brother, Irving, eldest of the sons, upon hearing of this catastrophic event, spoke on to us in this manner. Watch, he's a bright kid, he's got a brain, we can't make him an aviation mechanic. So my mother took me back to Abraham Lincoln High School. Now, when her wisdom and her wisdom, she probably thought that a trade would be a very handy thing to have, you know, because she had lived through a depression. And she knew that if you had a specific skill, you might be able to survive, at least tread water, some money would come in. And she was doing it for my best interests, of course, and my brother, who was always kind of brave, Gallant, noble, funny looking, said, really a great guy. He's a chemist, used to come home late at night and take two colorless liquids and precipitate them. It makes something white and one of the test tubes, you know, like you'd make a count, I don't know what he did. And he thought that I was fairly bright and wanted me to go on to college, and I did. And then he encouraged my eventual nation into show business. But David Susskind 51:39 go ahead, David Steinberg 51:40 I was gonna ask you to interrupt with a question. Oh, I've been asked if it was alright. If you would interrupt with a question. David Susskind 51:46 Would I interrupt with a question? David Steinberg 51:47 We lost the moment I saw very unimportant. Mel Brooks 51:50 I was being I was I was I was being serious. David Steinberg 51:53 Yes. And it was it was very interesting. Mel Brooks 51:55 And so my mother, when I when I got a job with Sid Caesar, writing the Show of Shows she, first of all, she'd never watched the show, because she was terrified that it wouldn't be good, and I'd be fired. So she'd only see the cruel would say, written by Mel Brooks. And that was that you turn it off. And she'd always say, things seriously, she'd say they, they don't know. It's all right. They don't know. I said, What do you mean, they don't know. She'd say, I mean, you're all right. They don't know. Like, I was a dummy. You know, you're never accepted in your own house like I was, it was some kind of a miracle. David Steinberg 52:31 But there's also the evil I think they don't want to compliment that's going to be taken away from the devil is going to hear it and take it away. Mel Brooks 52:37 Exactly. They she never believed that any of this was true. I never told her what I made. I mean, I began with $50 a week. And when I was a kid, I was when I was 23 24. I was making 5000 bucks a week, writing the Show of Shows David Susskind 52:50 What would have happen if you said your mother making 5000 a week Mel Brooks 52:53 Heart attack, her heart would attack her. David would have been very dangerous. I told her I made 38 40 a week. We that was all right. Yeah. David Susskind 53:04 She thought you're being overpaid. Mel Brooks 53:05 I gave a 48 a week. So Stan Herman 53:06 how did you find me? You know, in my business, for instance, if you have a credit New York Times and Ladies Home Journal, if you're on TV, if you won the Cody award, you've gotten 17 things going at once and two weeks go by and there's nothing in the paper and suddenly the phone rings. It's not just the mother though. What's wrong, business is bad. The whole thing is lousy. And they said well, there's nothing wrong. I mean, I had a credit two weeks ago it's a constant Mel Brooks 53:31 But they know the hip they read the they read variety. Now my mother, she said suck on Cleveland. Hey, Buffalo in Boston. We thought I performed Boston 23 To you took your breakeven is to eight we're gonna close I mean, they learn they get they're so sharp, so sophisticated, so quickly. They know all the showbusiness. powerlines all the Argo and then they they're great day short. And they are busty. Stan Herman 53:57 I gotta told Mother, mother, mother, yes. And she's about seven foot four. Big big lady. My first mother was small. My mother, you can only have one. I have two mothers because I had my father remarried when I was 13. And I have called a mother. I don't think there is anything else but that. Mel Brooks 54:17 Do you know that the child's the determination of the child's religion according to the Torah is determined by the mother's religion, that if your father is Jewish, and your mother is not, you are not Jewish, according to the Talmud, or whatever you whatever you write. If your mother is Jewish, you're Jewish, no matter what the religion of your father is. Because about 5000 years ago they figured out well we know the mother David Susskind 54:54 Coming right back.